Protect the flock! From JP and Hachette!
What are you doing right now?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by EndOfTheEarth on
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My audio review is up.
http://www.max-dan-wiz.com/forum/topics/angel-an-audio-review
Thoughts, comments?
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Permalink Reply by Xuut on
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Feeling exhausted.
My brother is sick and he kept me up ALL NIGHT. Well, most of the night. So I have (and still am) running off three hours of sleep. Surprisingly enough, I thought the Math quiz was insanely easy (translation, I failed) and I didn't fall asleep in any of my classes.
Also, I can officially properly under-hand serve in volleyball. EAT THAT KIDS WHO WOULDN'T FUCKING PICK ME ON THEIR TEAM FIRST, WHUT. WHO CAN SERVE NOW?
I have so much work... but eh... Break time!
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XD
The squees seem generally pissed about Max's romantic situation at the end of book 7. They're throwing fits, and it makes me want to smack them and shout, "Books are about PLOT, damn it!"
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Permalink Reply by nathan_p on
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I'm talking to someone about Max as a character, and she responded to my social-psych based rant with three sentences.
It's a shame you can't punch people over the Internet.
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Where is this? I feel the need to drop on more people, and it will help me reason out the events of the new book. I already have one interesting theory.
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I agree and disagree with you in a few places.
I. A Word On Psychology
OK, let's start with one of my pet hobbyhorses: Max is a lying liar who lies, JP is literally dumber than a sack full of hammers, Jeb is a miracle worker, pick two.
I've come to the conclusion that Patterson isn't a smart writer, but he is a smart businessman. While this results in cliche, continuity-lacking sex-fests, it sells.
According to Max's testimony, she was literally raised to age ten in a cage with minimal human interaction, as were the rest of the flock. Given that treatment, she literally should not be able to walk.
Wait, what? Why is that, Nathan?
Because a child raised in a restricted physical environment will never exercise their muscles. Barring extensive physical therapy, she would maybe be able to be pushed about in a wheelchair. She might walk with leg braces and crutches.
Actually, we can see from what they did to Angel that they probably had her out and about, running on treadmills, flying in wind tunnels, and such.
A child raised in a cage with no human contact -- well, you've just concocted one of psychology's most fascinating forbidden experiments: the feral child. Besides being unable to walk, the feral child is unable to speak, and may never communicate with other humans beyond very basic sentences. Depending on individual circumstances, they may never utter words understandable to the general public.
Aw, fuck, you're kidding.
No, I'm not. See the case of "Genie", who was discovered at age thirteen, slightly later than Max alleges she was freed from the School. She's still alive, but her vocabulary is in the range of, ooh, a two-year-old's, and she does not speak aloud, only through ASL.
Max may be super-intelligent, but without stimulus the mind cannot learn language. The oldest three birdkids would likely never progress further than Genie did. Nudge and Gazzy at five and seven might learn to speak near-fluently, but would possess odd behaviors likely throughout life. Angel, rescued at two, would probably be able to catch up to her age peers and surpass them given loving care.
Actually, I think a better explanation would be to note that Max did have constant human interaction, but the humans she interacted with were all evil, harmful people who saw her as less than human, and likely often brutalized her. Again, I ask you to look at Angel's school experience in TAE. The important thing about this is that it still affected Max's psychology, specifically her leadership style of how she'd "threaten and bully people into working together" (ANG, Ch39). As this was the only style most of them knew until they escaped from the school, the rest of the flock submitted when Max began her little takeover--that's all they knew how to do. The exception, as you pointed out, is Angel, because she was brought up with the idea of freedom and a television broadcasting American ideals of liberty and verbal interpersonal conflict resolution; hence why when Fang attempts to take a leadership role, he finds it so difficult, as he's been a follower for most of his life. Angel, on the other hand, has an easy time of it, because of how she's been brought up.
Since Max and the flock are not wheelchair-bound mutes, I conclude that one of two things actually happened to them.
Possibility one: Jeb is a more talented therapist (physical, mental, and speech) than the team that attempted to help Genie. I do not fucking believe this, since it's one thing for a single parent to raise six kids, and a whole kettle of bitey lampreys to ask that same man to raise six children with an assortment of issues.
Possibility two: Max is lying, and was raised in a neglectful environment that was not actually abusive enough to produce feral children. This is the one I support: you spend billions to create a mostly-human, human-looking thing, you're not going to toss it in a cage and say good day. You may not be able to take it to Disneyland and feed it ice cream at the park, but you will allow physical exercise and teach it language. Otherwise your billions have basically gone into conducting a forbidden experiment for kicks.
This one is closer to my theory, presented above.
II: Max Is A Raging Douche
This one I'll make short:
"No matter what happens, no one but me and a very, very select few people in my family deserve any emotion but hate or derision from me."
That's a lovely quote, where did you get it from?
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I've come to the conclusion that Patterson isn't a smart writer, but he is a smart businessman. While this results in cliche, continuity-lacking sex-fests, it sells.
Yeah :\ Also sadly not everyone has taken a psychology class.
Actually, we can see from what they did to Angel that they probably had her out and about, running on treadmills, flying in wind tunnels, and such.
True, but I was going by Max's testimony, which essentially alleges "and I was locked in a cage for ten years ;_;".
Basically, yes, yes, and also yes to all your points. In point of fact? Early environment neglectful but not quite abusive, with exposure to language and physical exercise.
However, for whatever reasons, whether her memories are false or she's actually lying, Max testifies differently.
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Well, my ANGEL epilogue theory just gained a second piece of supporting evidence.
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See my PM. Not everyone here has read ANGEL yet.
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XD
Just realized:
Max: "It's noy my fault that Dylan imprinted on me! And you know what? He's the only one who hasn't left me!" (Ch 53)
Not entirely true, Max. Total's never left you.
You can interpret that to be as dirty as you wish.
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